[JackMonroe]

That doesn't make sense to me. It is much harder for anybody untalented to become extremely good at CS then it is for COD, and there has always been huge gaps of skill between players in CS. It isn't hard for someone relatively new to do well in COD, but someone relatively new to Counter Strike isn't going to do nearly as well. Even in pubs in CS, similar players are always at the top of the leaderboards because the gap between those players and the less skilled players is so huge that the less skilled players have no chance to excel at the game and overcome the more skilled players. But in COD, it is much easier for a bad player to finish at the top of his team, and to do well much more frequently because the skill gap is smaller.

What he said.  It takes a few months to master COD.  It takes years and years to get better but never master CS.  I have played for 12 years now and I am still just like wow, I need to do this or that better.  Granted I haven't been playing in leagues for a while now which is what it really takes to get better once you reach the limitations of public game experience.

[Spartacus]

From a social aspect, most of the gameplays in COD games don't provide much interaction between players.

CSS however, when most of the players die, the server becomes a chatroom. That's how a community is built.

For example, the other day I found out Violent Love had her child home birthed. And she went to the mall a few hours later. I doubt she was trolling. :o

That doesn't make sense to me. It is much harder for anybody untalented to become extremely good at CS then it is for COD, and there has always been huge gaps of skill between players in CS. It isn't hard for someone relatively new to do well in COD, but someone relatively new to Counter Strike isn't going to do nearly as well. Even in pubs in CS, similar players are always at the top of the leaderboards because the gap between those players and the less skilled players is so huge that the less skilled players have no chance to excel at the game and overcome the more skilled players. But in COD, it is much easier for a bad player to finish at the top of his team, and to do well much more frequently because the skill gap is smaller.

What he said.  It takes a few months to master COD.  It takes years and years to get better but never master CS.  I have played for 12 years now and I am still just like wow, I need to do this or that better.  Granted I haven't been playing in leagues for a while now which is what it really takes to get better once you reach the limitations of public game experience.

True. I haven't been a regular gamer for years. Before I started playing css regularly I played MW2 a bit, and I found it  pretty easy, even as an inexperienced gamer. I got bored because there weren't really challenges anymore. I've been playing css for 4-5 months regularly and I still suck, only the awp I begin to get under control.

I have black ops on steam, almost never play it, but when I join it I lol, I have like 6 kills per death, most players there don't have regular css reaction and sound awareness.

I think a lot of your responses are half-proving my point. You say it is easier to get good at MW games (and in a shorter amount of time) compared to CSS. Ruplayer gave an example where he said he often had a 6kdr, and I remember having a similar experience. But for us to have such extremely high kdrs, the kdrs of most other players have to seriously suffer. It suggests that many of the players have to be at a significantly lower skill level than us. I remember getting scores around about 40-3 very consistently on Free-For-All mode (and that was within the first month of playing).

Maybe on average the skill level of people in CSS is greater, and that makes sense because it's an oldish game, and many of the players who are still around have been around since the start. But regardless of that, I still make my point that tomix simplified (thanks ;D): "In CSS, there are more limitations on how good a player can get, relative to other players. It is easier for a talented fps gamer to get extremely good at MW"

I understand that it may take longer for most people to get decent at CSS, but that's not actually what I'm trying to argue about.

I do agree with spartacus though, there's much less social interaction/less of a community. It probably also has something to do with the match making system in MW2 and 3 (I think?), as opposed to the dedicated servers that CSS uses.

This video needs to be posted in this thread dammit=)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-ltcCF_cAQ&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

[pTK]

Alright, here's my perspective (the perspective of a player that stomps you all at both games)   

it us harder for a player to become pro in source than it is in cod. Jack i'm happy for you that you are a naturally inclined gamer but that has nothing to do with levels of skill.  Saying cod is easy mode is totally false. Its easier to pubstar in but if you were to play scrims against some of the good teams you would get shit on do hard. I encourage you to go challenge area 51 or even iconic (who are a mediocre team)  ... Don't tell them I said that. Also keep in mind that cod is a console game first, PC game second. Most pro teams are on the xbox.    Also tonic, the statement that you can live from greater falls is totally bull.  Its the other way around.  don't even say perks. Because there's no perks in matches.

That doesn't make sense to me. It is much harder for anybody untalented to become extremely good at CS then it is for COD, and there has always been huge gaps of skill between players in CS. It isn't hard for someone relatively new to do well in COD, but someone relatively new to Counter Strike isn't going to do nearly as well. Even in pubs in CS, similar players are always at the top of the leaderboards because the gap between those players and the less skilled players is so huge that the less skilled players have no chance to excel at the game and overcome the more skilled players. But in COD, it is much easier for a bad player to finish at the top of his team, and to do well much more frequently because the skill gap is smaller.

What he said.  It takes a few months to master COD.  It takes years and years to get better but never master CS.  I have played for 12 years now and I am still just like wow, I need to do this or that better.  Granted I haven't been playing in leagues for a while now which is what it really takes to get better once you reach the limitations of public game experience.

True. I haven't been a regular gamer for years. Before I started playing css regularly I played MW2 a bit, and I found it  pretty easy, even as an inexperienced gamer. I got bored because there weren't really challenges anymore. I've been playing css for 4-5 months regularly and I still suck, only the awp I begin to get under control.

Lol George you has a similar the same story as me played in 9 months and i mostly get neutral scores and few times good ones but i still suck only with the awp i get in beast mode lol.

So far the 3 months that i played MW in all matches has low teamwork. 1 Pro can change the tide in the game.

[naive]

I think the reason COD seems so much easier is because of the huge quantity of more casual players that play. Counter-strike appeals to the more hardcore crowd I think. I've always stomped servers in COD using my cs skillz to the point where I got bored with it. From what I recall, if you get a few kills in a row they give you helicopters and shit to kill even more people and then you get even more assistance, and it really detracts from the balance of the game. It's like whoever gets the first few kills is likely to get an even larger rampage and end up as the map leader due to momentum, not skill. I don't think that there is a greater variance of skill in it, so much as the game itself is designed to make certain players get more kills than others.

[pTK]

^ What Naive Said.

You need to fish through the crowds of shitbad pubstars and play good players to get a real sense of the Mw3 community.