I'm making this thread to gauge the interest of wL players in a would be competitive events. To determine what type of events you guys want and also what features you guys would want to be added to better the competitive aspect of wL in general.
- The amount of players responding to the poll / commenting on the thread will be used to limit the size of events we might hold.
-- The options are ranked subjectively following what im the most motivated to help doing to the less.
--- The goal of each option is to make scrimming popular again and try to keep the amount of competitive players relatively high on (wL). And obviously have fun !
====================================================================================
Option 1 (Need 30 players + showing interest)
Doing a mix between a ladder and a regular league season.
You guys could mount a team like in the good old days, you wouldnt be restricted by scheduling every god damn week, but you would need to face off every team registered at least x amount of time before the end of the season time span. You guys can play the same team multiple times during the same season for whatever map you guys voted in pregame, it wont count as 15 wins and 3 defeats (the w-t-l will still be shown), the score of each games will be averaged, who ever is leading on that average will get the ranking point over the other team. That way of ranking teams could create potentially healthy rivalries between similar level teams during weeks or months.
Once the season time span is over, the ranks teams achieved during the ladder/season will be used to make the seeding for a tournament, if we get enough teams, maybe the worse teams wont be able to qualify for the tournament for time saving purposes. Again the format of the tournament will heavily depend on how many teams compete, if we have only 6-8 teams participating in the ladder/league, it could be done in 1 day/weekend of bo3's between teams. If we get more, we will need to either eliminate more teams, or make 2 tournaments (Top teams, Fun teams).
Option 2 (Need 20 players + showing interest)
Doing 1 tournament for each weather seasons like it was planned
Our original first tournament was in December (Winter), the 2nd was in April (Spring) and the 3rd we made was in Summer (we also tried to do a 4th event, but it wasn't a tournament), i really liked the idea of having a 1 weekend or 2 tournaments every now and then, using the weather seasons seemed like a good idea also, to give us some breaks from it. I'm not closed to the idea of making these again, but sadly it wasn't enough for people to make scrims in between tournaments, despite the changes bison made to the private servers to make them available at any time.
That being said, we know we had at least 6 teams every time we made 1 of these, so we know the interest was there and we kept improving since the first tournament.
Option 3 (Need 15 players + showing interest)
Doing 10 mens every weekend
We already tried implementing these through the 10 rws + restricted servers, the scrim service old thread that didnt get much interest and a bit before the first tournament. The problem with these is it's 100% unorganized, no teams, no schedule, nothing, it's basicly a pug but between people that appreciate each others, not randoms.
It sounds great in theory, these were awesome back in the days when scrimming was the norm, now having 10 decent players that like each other, online at the same time, is pretty rare.
What we could do with this is creating a restrictive list, that people could sign up in by posting on the would be forum thread, only players of minimum"x" amount of RWS will be included and only players without recent manual bans could join in (so no trolls, toxic players, etc.). And set an hour on Friday, Saturday Sunday (or only 1 of the 3), where you would need to join up a discord channel to make the teams (captains at random, no rws cap) ... you guys could play whatever amount of games with the same teams made on the same day or re-do captains for every game.
Whats great about these ... is that you dont need any admins around (lots of competitive minded players are admins anyway).
Option 4 (Need 20 players + showing interest)
Doing a rotation of draft/normal mini-tournaments every 2 weeks or month.
This is what i tried to implement last time i organized a competitive event on (wL) in NA, it seemed like a good idea on paper, but the absence of scarcity made people not care at all and 2 teams didnt even bothered showing up at all. And 1 team didnt show up for the finale either.
It was such a fiasco that i was honestly tempted of deleting this option. But we only tried it once, maybe it could be great, who knows.
In theory we would be scrimming almost every weekend with such a concept, maybe even during the weeks to practice a bit.
- But it would be very strict in schedule ... which we ALL know is not (wL) players forte.
- And a lot less meaningful then a league/ladder or big tournaments
- And without the fun of 10 mens.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Voting for option 1, still leave open the possibility of a mix with option 2 and it would make (wL) COMP popular enough to make a variant of option 3 doable.
But chosing option 4 makes option 1 and 2 undoable, cause we cant organize mini-tournaments/events at the same time as big ones it would be too confusing for some people (hmm ask Helmut). Drafts are basically a tournament of 10 mens, so option 3 would still be available.
You guys have 2 votes to use.
==================================================================================
Other details for a league/ladder :
- Either there will be no fee to pay to enter, or there will be a fixed donation minimum to give at (wL) every year/6 months, 5 or 10$ lets say
- Im not sure it would be in (wL) best interests to make a big prize pot, i think it would be a motive for people to buy cheats and drama will inevitably follow, sure there will be backgrounds checks and only players who have played either here or on esea will be allowed, but regulars or ex-eseaers could still buy some cheats for quick $.
- If we get a ladder/league going, COMP stats will be a thing, since the amount of matches, scrims, 10 mens and else will justify the effort put in by our staff. A leaderboard specific to the ladder/league will also be a thing (top KPG, ADR, RWS, Clutches, Multiple Frags, Team Rankings, Teams W-T-L).
- Teams could be modified during 3/4 of the season, each team could have a team manager (captain), but i think it would be more fair if teams made in-group votes to accept or kick someone from a team, obviously anyone could leave their team anytime they want.
- Teams would be restricted to 8 players, 5 players in the roster 5, 3 back ups. If there is any outside of team subs in the beginning of a particular match the result of said match will not count for the season ranking, any matches where you start with 5 team members you need to end it with 5 team members (not necessarly the sames), outside of teams subs won't be allowed if someone has to go to.
Sorry for all the typos and mistakes, im speaking french after all.
Have a great time on (wL) !
- The amount of players responding to the poll / commenting on the thread will be used to limit the size of events we might hold.
-- The options are ranked subjectively following what im the most motivated to help doing to the less.
--- The goal of each option is to make scrimming popular again and try to keep the amount of competitive players relatively high on (wL). And obviously have fun !
====================================================================================
Option 1 (Need 30 players + showing interest)
Doing a mix between a ladder and a regular league season.
You guys could mount a team like in the good old days, you wouldnt be restricted by scheduling every god damn week, but you would need to face off every team registered at least x amount of time before the end of the season time span. You guys can play the same team multiple times during the same season for whatever map you guys voted in pregame, it wont count as 15 wins and 3 defeats (the w-t-l will still be shown), the score of each games will be averaged, who ever is leading on that average will get the ranking point over the other team. That way of ranking teams could create potentially healthy rivalries between similar level teams during weeks or months.
Once the season time span is over, the ranks teams achieved during the ladder/season will be used to make the seeding for a tournament, if we get enough teams, maybe the worse teams wont be able to qualify for the tournament for time saving purposes. Again the format of the tournament will heavily depend on how many teams compete, if we have only 6-8 teams participating in the ladder/league, it could be done in 1 day/weekend of bo3's between teams. If we get more, we will need to either eliminate more teams, or make 2 tournaments (Top teams, Fun teams).
Option 2 (Need 20 players + showing interest)
Doing 1 tournament for each weather seasons like it was planned
Our original first tournament was in December (Winter), the 2nd was in April (Spring) and the 3rd we made was in Summer (we also tried to do a 4th event, but it wasn't a tournament), i really liked the idea of having a 1 weekend or 2 tournaments every now and then, using the weather seasons seemed like a good idea also, to give us some breaks from it. I'm not closed to the idea of making these again, but sadly it wasn't enough for people to make scrims in between tournaments, despite the changes bison made to the private servers to make them available at any time.
That being said, we know we had at least 6 teams every time we made 1 of these, so we know the interest was there and we kept improving since the first tournament.
Option 3 (Need 15 players + showing interest)
Doing 10 mens every weekend
We already tried implementing these through the 10 rws + restricted servers, the scrim service old thread that didnt get much interest and a bit before the first tournament. The problem with these is it's 100% unorganized, no teams, no schedule, nothing, it's basicly a pug but between people that appreciate each others, not randoms.
It sounds great in theory, these were awesome back in the days when scrimming was the norm, now having 10 decent players that like each other, online at the same time, is pretty rare.
What we could do with this is creating a restrictive list, that people could sign up in by posting on the would be forum thread, only players of minimum"x" amount of RWS will be included and only players without recent manual bans could join in (so no trolls, toxic players, etc.). And set an hour on Friday, Saturday Sunday (or only 1 of the 3), where you would need to join up a discord channel to make the teams (captains at random, no rws cap) ... you guys could play whatever amount of games with the same teams made on the same day or re-do captains for every game.
Whats great about these ... is that you dont need any admins around (lots of competitive minded players are admins anyway).
Option 4 (Need 20 players + showing interest)
Doing a rotation of draft/normal mini-tournaments every 2 weeks or month.
This is what i tried to implement last time i organized a competitive event on (wL) in NA, it seemed like a good idea on paper, but the absence of scarcity made people not care at all and 2 teams didnt even bothered showing up at all. And 1 team didnt show up for the finale either.
It was such a fiasco that i was honestly tempted of deleting this option. But we only tried it once, maybe it could be great, who knows.
In theory we would be scrimming almost every weekend with such a concept, maybe even during the weeks to practice a bit.
- But it would be very strict in schedule ... which we ALL know is not (wL) players forte.
- And a lot less meaningful then a league/ladder or big tournaments
- And without the fun of 10 mens.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Voting for option 1, still leave open the possibility of a mix with option 2 and it would make (wL) COMP popular enough to make a variant of option 3 doable.
But chosing option 4 makes option 1 and 2 undoable, cause we cant organize mini-tournaments/events at the same time as big ones it would be too confusing for some people (hmm ask Helmut). Drafts are basically a tournament of 10 mens, so option 3 would still be available.
You guys have 2 votes to use.
==================================================================================
Other details for a league/ladder :
- Either there will be no fee to pay to enter, or there will be a fixed donation minimum to give at (wL) every year/6 months, 5 or 10$ lets say
- Im not sure it would be in (wL) best interests to make a big prize pot, i think it would be a motive for people to buy cheats and drama will inevitably follow, sure there will be backgrounds checks and only players who have played either here or on esea will be allowed, but regulars or ex-eseaers could still buy some cheats for quick $.
- If we get a ladder/league going, COMP stats will be a thing, since the amount of matches, scrims, 10 mens and else will justify the effort put in by our staff. A leaderboard specific to the ladder/league will also be a thing (top KPG, ADR, RWS, Clutches, Multiple Frags, Team Rankings, Teams W-T-L).
- Teams could be modified during 3/4 of the season, each team could have a team manager (captain), but i think it would be more fair if teams made in-group votes to accept or kick someone from a team, obviously anyone could leave their team anytime they want.
- Teams would be restricted to 8 players, 5 players in the roster 5, 3 back ups. If there is any outside of team subs in the beginning of a particular match the result of said match will not count for the season ranking, any matches where you start with 5 team members you need to end it with 5 team members (not necessarly the sames), outside of teams subs won't be allowed if someone has to go to.
Sorry for all the typos and mistakes, im speaking french after all.
Have a great time on (wL) !
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